"JR1" (type35bugatti)
04/11/2016 at 08:48 • Filed to: Cadillac
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"JR1" (type35bugatti)
04/11/2016 at 08:48 • Filed to: Cadillac | 0
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Do you think the Seville signified the beginning of the end for Cadillac? It was supposed to compete with the SEL 450 but unlike the SEL 450 the Seville attracted an older crowd.
I am not so sure the Seville can be the Cadillac to blame. I think you could argue the second generation (when they moved to fwd) was more of a problem. And the car that set up that fwd precedent? The 67 Eldorado. So perhaps the Eldorado started Cadillacs downfall.
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KatzManDu
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 08:52 |
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I think the diesel engine shenanigans and the 4-6-8 engine failures of the early 80s is what hosed Cadillac more than anything else.
I loved the style of this...
http://cadillac.motherauto.com/image/68747470…
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JR1
> KatzManDu
04/11/2016 at 08:56 |
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The diesel no doubt hurt the reputation so badly that it killed diesel cars in the US for decades
jimz
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 08:59 |
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the first Seville wasn’t bad. it was the second gen with that ugly bustleback which turned it into a joke. The Olds diesel was just the partially-digested peanut on top of a shit sundae.
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JR1
> jimz
04/11/2016 at 09:01 |
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I think I could agree to that. The 2nd gen Seville was a bit of a mistake
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jimz
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 09:07 |
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and the sad part was that the problems with the Olds diesel had practically nothing to do with it being based on the Olds gas V8s. The diesel was significantly stronger mechanically (drag racers used to use diesel blocks); the only weakness inherent to the engine was the fact that each cylinder was surrounded by only four head bolts so they could re-use production tooling from the gas engine. The real problems with the engine were
GM skimped and omitted a water trap from the fuel system. this caused a few problems; the Stanadyne injection pump was entirely fuel-lubricated so any contaminants trashed it in short order
the early Stanadyne “pencil” injectors were also sensitive to contamination, and water in the fuel would lead to misfires due to an incomplete fuel injection event. the next ignition event would lead to an over-pressure event in the affected cylinder which would exceed the head bolts’ clamping force and compromise the head gasket.
the early cars used 12 volt glow plugs which could take over a minute to pre-heat before you could crank.
With good ARP head bolts or studs and a water separator in the fuel line, these are actually really stout engines. But just like they’d go on to do with the Fiero, by the time GM got it right nobody wanted to touch the damn things.
The 4.3 diesel V6 fixed the head bolt weakness problem; it was a clean-sheet block design so it had five head bolts around each cylinder.
LongbowMkII
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 09:12 |
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Why’d you put a picture of a caprice classic on top?
The 67 eldo is awesome, FWD or not.
FSI - alcohol enthusiast with a car problem
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 09:16 |
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My favorite Cadillac can’t be that bad.
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JR1
> jimz
04/11/2016 at 09:16 |
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I never realized that was the issue I don’t think I ever looked into it. It does look like classic GM mistakes though. It is unfortunate really
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JR1
> LongbowMkII
04/11/2016 at 09:18 |
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I am assuming you are joking but you bring up a good point the Cadillac looks a lot like the Caprice
It is awesome but I do think it set a precedent
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jimz
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 09:26 |
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plus it didn’t help that they sounded kind of nasty. Where the Mercedes OM616/617 sounded like a more refined “purr”
the Olds engine just sounded clattery and nasty. it would have been acceptable in a truck, but not an upscale car.
Birddog
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 09:59 |
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The numbers that the Seville sold in regardless of price was Cadillacs downfall. Volume is addictive. Suddenly there was incentive to sell in volume at any cost rather than maintain prestige.
jasmits
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 10:03 |
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I mean I went to look and if I couldn’t discern the Cadillac crest upfront I would have no idea whether it was the caddy or the Chevy
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jasmits
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 10:04 |
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I think the biggest problem was how much better than the norm. The Seville wasn’t any different in principal from previous successful Cadillacs. The Benz just set a new precedent in build quality especially.
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JR1
> jimz
04/11/2016 at 10:09 |
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I think there is no doubt Mercedes was cranking out more refined automobiles
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JR1
> Birddog
04/11/2016 at 10:11 |
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I think that was certainly part of the problem. They didn’t have the discipline to keep prices up and volume down.
Somethin' 'bout a truck
> JR1
04/11/2016 at 11:52 |
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This looks to good to be a downturn...
